Dutch language

How to pronounce perpetrate in Dutch?

Full Transcript

good afternoon welcome everybody I'm
Edwin Carol's one of the many festival
programmers thank you for coming on a
Friday afternoon sitting in semi dark
which is excellent exercise for your
eyes because I assume you're interested
in the quay brothers latest stint it's
not a film it's not an installation what
is it it's a guided tour through an
imaginary universe and a feature film
still in the making they're here because
they created a new work dream pools and
collecting holes which officially opens
from this evening at 6:00 in tenth
individuate Street I hope you go there
and it's gonna be even darker than here
so that's the reason I mention your
dimming of the eye side but once you get
accustomed to the special atmosphere and
lighting setting set up they did it's a
fantastic experience they're also here
with a 35 millimeter film that can only
be shown on 35 so on saturday we're
showing the latest short film adult the
doll's breath and that's accompanied by
another film by a french artist
theatre and now filmmaker patricia a leo
because we invited the quay brothers as
part of our framework scheme and
frameworks is people with a reputation
asking them to go out of their comfort
zone and create something special for
the festival but also to invite somebody
we don't have on our radar but that
deserves to be on the radar of the
festival film festival circuit patricia
oh she's also here welcome Patricia she
made a beautiful film reconstruction of
a hunting scene so if you look in the
program hunting scenes but all brave
Patricia's film will be shown on
Saturday so much for practical things or
informative films and I'd like to give
the microphone to Jeff Andrew writer
teacher programmer from London one of
the eminent voices of the Time magazine
Time Out magazine in London who's going
to do the interview with
gray brother welcome Jeff welcome
timothy cedar yes thank you for coming
along this afternoon the format roughly
I mean it will be here for about 90
minutes and I'll be asking quite a few
questions because I've had the
misfortune to know these people for some
time and know their work and so I've had
time to think about trying to trip them
up with some awkward questions but there
will be time for you to ask questions as
well and we'll also be showing some
clips and in fact I think okay well
obviously being here in Rotterdam you
know that Timothy and Steven don't just
make films because there is the the
exhibition on but I think the brothers
wanted to start with that I presume
because it shows that you don't just
make films that you do live-action and
stop-motion but you also have worked in
the theatre opera music videos all sorts
of stuff
and indeed interested in art rather than
just film art generally when did you I
mean we often talk about music and other
stuff as well so you obviously at art is
a big preoccupation when did you first
start getting so interested in art just
before we went to art school we probably
made a decision
remember our Father said I'll back you
up whichever way you want to go whether
it's you want to go do art or you want
to do physical education like teach that
kind of thing and we're just the last
minute we went for the the Philadelphia
College of Art and that's how
I think we started to really commit
ourselves and I think new studied film
and you studied illustration was that
the case or it was a blurred case of
mistaken identity between both of us so
you were both doing a bit of both well
yes because on the on the weekends you
did you'd ask you rent a camera I mean
you take a camera out and of course we
both work on the film together so it
just happened to be that I was sort of
more III was one who could sign out the
cameras and when was it that you
actually decide what when did you first
decide you wanted to make films in
particular and also what was it about
the medium that attracted you so much
well I you know I think that with the
education that we had in graphics and
drawing that there there that was the
main formation but then of course we'd
seen a lot of animation films so you
sort of the famous line by Paul clay
take a line for a walk seemed to be
really instructive and and we'd seen
some cutout animation films and then we
immediately thought that was viable we
liked that sense where it was less
drawing but more on the graphic side
collage and and and we'd seen some films
by Lin Itza and Burroughs check which
were very pushed us in a certain
direction was that was that when you
first became interested in Eastern
European stuff I think because we were
at the on the college philosophically
that there were two magazines that
managed to filter into the place one was
the Browse graphic and then one was
graph ease and it's when we suddenly saw
the the examples of poster art from
whether it be Czechoslovakia Poland and
Russia but that in particularly I think
was the Polish that attract
because at the same time there was an
exhibition at the village of ecology of
classic polish posters from the 50s and
60s and what struck us was that it
unlike at the time what American posters
were doing Polish person was simply
saying it would say vote sec TR travel
key and Alban Berg episode three three
three names and that set us off into a
kind of voyage into the the
constellations of all these potentials
what what they suggested in music what
they suggested in operand and that's was
the primordial example and also those
posters have much more interest in
inform than the American posters we
talked about content I mean the whole
thing was that where in America there
was a division of labor they would say
an illustrator cannot be a typographer
you hand it off to the next person in in
Poland and saying most of the Eastern
Bloc it was the case of the artist was
seminal so if he did it by hand the
typography if you did it by paint with
his left hand
it worked so he did everything yeah
which we'll still doing these days
something how did the move to Europe or
to London and then and Europe come about
and why well we came we and I mean to
really compress a long story into a
short story we went back to America but
then we got fed up with doing in the end
we had to do dishwashing and waitering
and one of them it doesn't matter but
there a dutch friend of ours was at the
Royal College said listen guys if you're
washing dishes in in in Philadelphia you
can wash them in Amsterdam and we
thought that was such a great idea so
what
and so at that precise moment we seem to
have gotten a grant a National Endowment
grant something like ten thousand
dollars and we just said it's like
you're out of here
we came out and we told her mother we're
going away for two weeks and you're
still here still here but but we landed
in Amsterdam and we worked a bit and
then we moved to The Hague and then but
just before that we left our producer in
London who Jeff knows very well
suggested that we Keith Keith Keith
Griffiths that we leave some kind of a
scenario for an experimental film and we
said we don't do experimental films we
didn't even know what it meant and so we
wrote we said we'll do something for
Pappas it just do it so we wrote
something and then we went to Amsterdam
and then six months later we got a
message saying you've got the money now
make your Papa film and before
we go onto our next clip and what is the
thing about puppets that attracted you
because that is seems to be central to
so much of your work no I think I think
it was the idea that we felt that being
brothers that that you know having a
relationship that we have that working
on a small table with a with a couple of
puppets was exactly the remedy because I
think we were a bit intimidated by the
the live-action world we thought that
the working with puppets would solve
that problem that nobody would be
looking you you you would have and we'd
learn the craft you know stage by stage
building the puppets learning how to
light things how to fail miserably and
then you know but slowly build up your
confidence and I think that that's that
I mean of course
it also was that we when we were living
in Amsterdam we went down to Brussels to
see the we heard about the tone
marionette theater and it was there that
I think it was something that just you
know he clicked it just said this is the
the density that we wanted from what
puppets could achieve is they seem to
represent emissaries from the beyond and
I think that was something that really
attracted us and but we also had to
learn to master the the technical side
of it so it took a while but the great
thing is that puppets can't talk back to
you when you're directing them so which
leads we said that no I think it's the
difference between you know with you
know it's the difference between working
with live actors where you you try to
elicit a performance and with puppets
you you do have to impose a performance
so it's the difference but we're you
know that's there's a clear difference
there twin stone reminded me last night
that the last person who fought was over
by way of introduction doesn't say his
name which is it which is no yeah so
this was working with proper human
actors how was that after having not
done that for so long
well I think that Keith our producer
said at one point after Street of
crocodiles would you guys ever consider
making a live-action film and we said no
never and then but then we were reading
jakob von goethe at the time and we said
well if he could keep it as a chamber
play very intimate with a few a handful
of actors that we might be we would try
it and yeah then it just suddenly things
started happening and there was money
the Germans came on board the Japanese
came on board
the screen and channel 4 so it was done
for a million pounds at that time and it
was a minimal budget and I was just
going to say that but that was 1995 but
almost 21 years before we first started
reading reading but Robert Bazell and it
was from a Times Literary Supplement
yeah it's an article written by
Christopher Middlewood little militant
and he said and the the headline was
portrait of a nobody and we looked at
each other and we said that's for us it
was Robert Valle sir and it was the
first translations of Robert Vadra into
English and so 21 years later
unbeknownst we were able to make this
film and you created this little middle
european place in a hampton court I know
man I remember coming down on the set
and also some of it in your in your
studio and actually most of your films
it seems to me a in many ways primarily
about creating worlds creating cosmoses
or universes would you sort of is that
how you see it because you you are
creating things that don't actually
exist no I think that that every film
you started with this sort of the it's
the idea of the scenography as a poetic
vessel
so within Steuben Dementor the thing
that most attracted us was that the
Institute itself the school and that we
gave it a sort of a prehistory that it
was a originally was a perfume factory
and that the the man who had this
perfume factory had in the attic in the
top floor
a tiny Museum because which was devoted
to the dear the elements of the dear
and because perfume the essential
element is musk which comes from the
deer and it's as though he this this
imagine this person who had the museum
created all the the footnotes all the
marginalia
around the kingdom of the deer and it
also was very much that in a way vol Sur
worked very powerfully with the fairy
tale elements and the kingdom of animals
is very much a part of fairy tale lore
folklore and so we created this huge
hopefully spell that that the that that
the people who who were in in the school
between either the brother and sister
who ran the school were hugely
contaminated by all this animal kingdom
lore and of course it was a little bit
like Lisa was the Sleeping Beauty hair
Binyam enter was the ogre and Jakob and
guten was the princeling who arrives
from you know from nowhere from out of
the forest arrives not with the kiss of
life but ultimately with the kiss of
death so that was what that was what we
were trying to perpetrate yeah I mean
they were even I think there were seven
seven four seven four of course the
Seven Dwarfs were the students exactly
and it's it you actually did do a proper
sort of script for this film with Alan
passes and you it was an adaptation
did you actually stick closely to that
script because I know sometimes you'd
that you don't you sort of have a script
and then you sort of more or less throw
it away and let the film develop as you
shoot it no I with with the the feature
films we've always I partially as a
challenge but we've always you know
we've written very detailed scripts with
detailed lighting deep
you know for the lighting cameraman we
everything was really powerfully there
on the page with the animation films we
were much more they're much more
intelligent Bluffs that you throw to the
the the the commissioning whether it's
channel for the bf5 even to the producer
exactly because in a sense you know it's
a little bit that we you know a feature
film we this one was shot in 30 days so
you knew you had a hugely you had to be
really focused and we can be really
disciplined like that but with the
animation films you realize it's gonna
take a year year and a half two years
nobody's and they give up following you
after a while they don't they forget and
that's great so we have two years later
we wave and say the film's finished and
and that's that's but you know it's very
much where the studio becomes a kind of
laboratory so you have an element you
there's a huge chance to explore the
what you've actually not really put on
the page but what you haven't put on the
page and in the sense where for instance
if you say it's like in a script you
could you can't say the music will solve
it here or that we're animating to music
here they wouldn't they wouldn't believe
you they don't they wouldn't buy that
but for us you know the music is the
secret scenario so we always tend to
have the music first and then we
elaborate the script within the the
realm of the the what the composer has
has established and yeah yeah well we'll
come back to music later because there's
a particular clip that sort of draws it
out but it's interesting in watching
this film again recently you have a bit
of voiceover from jakab that Mark
Rylance character but you also have the
shots of Lisa dreaming and it's
it's very ambiguous about whose story
this really is in the film who is
dreaming it or who is experiencing it
and in fact like many of your films
there's this idea what is it dream or is
it reality and that line is very very
blurred and keep things keep flipping
over well I know
Jakob I mean those who spoke powerfully
of this sufficient veldt
this half between world where you
couldn't quite recognize either up or
down or before after we're dreaming and
and and and no I I think that um in a
way with the intro been your mentor was
that you you weren't quite sure whether
it was the Institute itself that was
perpetrating the dream upon the
characters or was it Lisa or or was it
Jakob or the confusion so I think
there's floating world's appeal to us
clearly and I think vaulters work courts
that beautifully is also because it was
a quote by Rilke that said that the
people in the Institute were assigned a
disease and therefore they died so in a
way the Institute when you mentor was
one of those victims of course I
personally think it's Noel's story
throughout but that's another thing
before we move on to the next clip I
want to talk about sound I mean it's it
seems particularly important modeling in
this film but in all your films because
quite off I mean here you of course you
have dialogue but sound is very much
about creating this this this world and
we never really see the outside of the
Institute apart from at the very
beginning when he comes to the door but
we're very aware of things outside and
do you spend a lot of time thinking
about forget music for now but about
sound I mean you're talking about being
a mentor yeah I mean the the the thing
is that as you said we shot outside
London at Hampton Court
and of course that song the the flight
path of Heathrow so every other minute
the planes were flying over a top and we
be constantly saying wait in the past
we'd go and but there was the buzz of
lights the hum of just the atmosphere
and so in the end and Larry cider our
sound person said them listen we just
scrap everything and we start anew and
we recorded all the sound all the actors
were totally freaked out by having to do
redo their voices but they fell into at
the end and so every sound was was
recreated but I think it what it did in
the end was create this
it's beautiful intimacy because this
sounds yeah they're very subtle so it
doesn't feel like a normal sound film I
took Matt getting the actors to have to
do that I mean how how did you direct
the actors because it wasn't something
you'd had to do before you were having
not not to impose but to elicit no I
mean I remembered that when we we had a
yes a choreographer friend Kim branch
trip to come on board to help us with
the students and we sort of said to Kim
listen take these Seven Dwarves
and and and work with them on on certain
themes so we gave certain themes about
folding napkins maybe how to handle a
fork a lot of a lot of little bizarre
themes and of course the students
contributed hugely to the invention so
at the end of the day we go in and we
see this and that and then Tim is you
know I would say this is we're gonna
pull this scene out we're gonna pull
that one out and and that was the way we
worked with with the students so they
contributed hugely and we chose every
one of the students because we said we
we didn't want English actors we wanted
all the foreigners to drift in so the
the there was a Dane you know the
Sicilian you know they were all
different and it was fantastic their
contribution like that but as we said it
was an international school for servants
and was like well you took about the
direct and servants and oh yeah and then
but I know with was say somebody like
Gottfried
you really didn't have to overly coax
him he he knew the role right away like
that res Alice was constantly we'd sit
with her every night and run through
things the script and then talk about
the way she might do it so we were very
attentive to to eliciting that
performance because I think we because
we didn't know we didn't we didn't have
the experience but what we did have is a
certain instinct for what was right and
what we wanted from the film so she was
very you know we read mark the first the
camera frame and they had to choreograph
themselves that they had to hit a point
you know and that they were locked off
frames and that the choreography was
very important for that and then you had
Rylands whose face in that yeah it's
just extraordinary and it is throughout
the film it sort of expressive was
Keaton or something but we said that was
the one thing we said to mark when when
he came on board we said Buster Keaton
if you can get new anywhere close that
that the face as a mass is crucial you
know in the eyes right yes exactly
I'd say I should explain that it was
just he'd Stephen and Timothy who chose
these clips it wasn't me alone I sort of
tried to make sense of their
instructions when when they were talking
about plot and characters I had no idea
who what they were talking about but we
got there in the end why did you choose
this clip but it's the Enuma of the
the entire piece I think had to come to
an end but but also it will be repeated
he'll go right back in again
it'll discover things that he hadn't
seen which we still have to film yet I
mean it's it's Schultz and indeed of
course your new your new film is
inspired by a short novel sanatorium
under the sign of the hourglass and that
in itself is what the exhibition is
about as well so what is the the great
appeal of Schulz for you well I mean in
it was interesting that when we applied
to the British Film Institute for to do
a second film they felt that our sense
of narrative was so wayward and so
useless that they said oh you have to
base it on on a piece of literature so
we said we said okay Bruno Schultz who's
as we laugh to ourselves the least
narrative writer meymaneh balandin this
is this is great so we thought I should
say that somebody's worked at the BFI it
is one the most illiterate places I
believe this no but I think that what
we've been to by then we traveled to
Poland and maybe to pick up on an
earlier thing when you said about the
fascination with Eastern Europe the
thing that we you know even in our early
years in Philadelphia
we'd seen a lot of Eastern European
animation and I think that what we
realized that what Eastern Europe was
able to do was a highly metaphoric
universe where they obviously fronted
one story to present a coded second
story so there was a lot of deeper
elements within it and I think having
been raised and force-fed on Disney as
kids all our life it was a welcome
change and and also just the
sophistication of and the quality of the
animation and the poetry so that when we
came to our travels to Poland we we had
a very dear friend Andre kievsky who
introduced us and said I think you
should read shorts we'd read Kafka and
he said this is sort of in that
territory but it's it's polish and when
we there's only two volumes of his work
that exists short stories but the first
volume you know fascinated us was the
street of crocodiles the story although
we brought in many of the themes from
all the short stories like that but
there was the the element of there was
something in shorts that there was this
what he called the poetic ascendancy of
the everyday and that matter wasn't dead
there was constant fermentation in in
flight and movement and was these
elements that and talking about
mannequins dummies that he gave such a
depth in a range to the material that we
we felt that we this was something to
step up to in a more metaphoric language
in a more metaphysical language that he
dealt with so that's this descript was
fairly detailed but with so much was
discovered as we actually filmed which
is pretty much the way we always work I
mean in a way that sort of writing where
objects take on a life and the
environment has a life just as much as
any of the characters that's perfect
material for puppet animators really
because that's what you're doing you're
giving life to screws and to
string no it's it well as the puppets
it's a total animistic sideshow in a way
it's complete freeing up that kind of
universe where you know these these
objects become sort of transitional
narrative elements that you you can tell
so much of the story through without we
don't work with our puppets don't speak
ever so it's the mask that speaks that's
just part of our language and I mean
that as you've alluded to the the
narrative is not your main concern I
mean obviously there's texture and form
and shape and whatever and mood but did
if you had problems with people saying
well hang on we don't understand this
but you said it's gonna be based on this
story and look what I don't you know
this is incomprehensible and as that
caused problems ever I think
totally but but I think for us that the
there's the scenography is the most
powerful in terms of the objects they're
what they symbolize what they can
potentially symbolize becomes the the
secret scenario plus along with the
music
but but if I mean we always say that the
film is follow musical roles rather than
dramaturgical laws and I think that's
where we place the the depth of the
animation and then the conception yeah
and also because you realize too that
with say anybody who goes to the ballet
never sits and says oh where's the
narrative on that one you know where's
the dialogue where and why they accept
they accept they accept the language of
dance is something that's that you have
to work at and the same with our film
they're not difficult and actually were
convinced were pretty narrative so I'm
persuaded there was narrative there
it's based on somebody could Emma Hawke
who wrote letters from an asylum in
which had been institutionalized to him
and I think her husband and the letters
are fairly illegible and but so there is
there is a narrative there will be a
small one which you develop according to
objects and mood since but also
couldn'ta sounds and the music was by
karl-heinz Stockhausen now sometimes
you've had music specifically written
for your films that's particularly key
yankovsky but often you've you've
enjoyed taking existing music could you
talk about how that works and also in
particularly how it work with
Stockhausen here this this was a BBC
program where they took the bull by the
horns by saying rather than saying like
Hollywood does we do the music
afterwards they said we'll do the music
first and we'll bring the directors on
afterwards so there was a commission
that was the Commission so the
Commission the composers first so there
was a Louis Andreessen who was given to
how Hartley John Sir John Taverner was
given to venner Hertzog Nicolas Roeg was
given somebody else but he chose
Portishead and we were off we were
offered Stockhausen after we were told
that ten people refused him directors so
we left for it but in that sense I we
thought it was it fell into our hands
because we always would have the music
first so and he was rather happy when he
saw the results when he saw your film
yes first we had to the BBC said we had
to send him a show real to be approved
by him and he said they're okay and then
then we could begin but then after the
bell we filmed the first say ten minutes
he came to London to look at what we
were doing and he sold the first ten
minutes and and at the end he said guys
I think just maybe just a little bit of
blue somewhere in the middle we should
sit okay okay so um he was very he let
it go at that
but but what was interesting was in the
end when we had to we had to go to
Cologne to show him the final the final
piece and part of the deal was the BBC
the BBC film crew came with us because
they wanted to talk to Stockhausen after
the film and so like when the lights go
up you know the BBC crew are right here
in the foreground filming karl-heinz to
get that reaction you know ever felt
like this is mad and so Timothy and I
are sitting in at the back ready to run
and the lights go up and and you see the
BBC crew filming and suddenly because
Stockhausen has two wives so on both
sides of him they stand up and they go
they flagged the the film crew down from
filming and we thought oh and what was
what happened was that he was he was
overcome but he was overcome because he
thought that we we knew that his mother
had been gassed by the Nazis and that we
had intuited that this was a portrait of
his mother because you only see in the
film you only ever see her from behind
so he thought that we knew something
there were a telepathic telepathic and
that was the word he used telepathic and
we didn't we didn't know about this this
this detail and after he composed
himself he then went on to talk
for an hour to the BBC film crew very
eloquently very calmly and you know this
it was quite remarkable in that sense
pretty lucid and one of the things I
love about this film and it so many of
them is is that you get an extraordinary
sense of scale in in your film so
sometimes you're dealing with little
pencil points and things but at the same
time you feel that this this room she's
in is almost as big as a cosmos in
itself
it feels infinitely imprisoning in a way
and it's scale something that concerns
you a great deal because it's used to go
from very small to very large even
though you're working with often with
very small things well I remember the
the the there was a beautiful quote by
Leonora Carrington where she said that
one eye should be plunged into the
microscope and the other into the
stratosphere telescope like that and I
think that always has made a strong
impression about you know the the sense
of ratio between you know macro
close-ups and sometimes your your your
your wide shots or your long shot the
interesting thing is that that the the
landscapes in the film were done
incredibly small and very miniature like
that but of course once it goes to 35
millimeter film film and the big screen
nobody has any sense of what our scale
is what what size the objects are or
whatever and that's and I think that's
where that's in a way our power you know
our ability to to know that that what
you can achieve it at the microscopic
level or whatever or where the confusion
works to advantage you know it's another
reason why you should go to the
exhibition that tent because you can see
how big certain things are I think
inside the potentiality of all these
drawers of becoming areas where not only
we would attempt to look for the
marginal next project or whatever but
that was something parallel or akin to
that yeah I mean if I'm watching it
again it just feels not exactly
autobiographical but so relevant to what
you do and I could giant bibliothèque I
mean all these drawers you need ladders
and ladders upon ladders to discover and
if there's not enough time but you may
do with what is that you know the height
of your reach yeah I've been also
watching these these clips one is
reminded that you you keep coming back
to certain things in your films I mean
there is even I think it's a sort of
telescope in in the hourglass at the
sanatorium and I'm from the sign of the
hourglass at one point and it's you keep
having bits of string and and sort of
optical devices and screws and dust and
whatever I should imagine that's about
recycling given that you've have your
collection of things that you you have
to use to put in your films but they
must mean things to you that you do have
sort of fetish objects that you really
like using in your films well clearly no
no I I think you know ultimately you're
trying to find another you're trying to
advance it one or something so you're
trying to elaborate it in a different
context nobody blames Scorsese for using
Gennaro twenty times I'm not I'm not
blaming you I'm actually thanking you
you know that's why I keep watching the
film so I want to see those screws and
string a bit
more you know but no I'm not I just
think do you think oh I loved using this
particular thing in in movers other hand
I think they I don't think that we you
know that you I don't want to be
defensive or something but in in a sense
you you try hard not to to repeat you
try to if you do it's like I said
earlier you're trying to augment a
metaphor or a parallel and I think
that's that's that's valid but without
being too specific we don't have to make
a litany of things but no I think you're
always you know you're always trying to
find another another channel another
language to push a kind of you know
Cortazar spoke about a secret order you
know sort of less communicable but in a
sense where you know you were not
obeying the laws of reality we're
looking for those exceptions like that
and that's the sort of I think that's
ultimately what's in the back of your
mind when you're working like in the
studio I'm not saying one shouldn't
repeat and do I mean look at bark or
mirror
buzu yeah there's a lot of good people
doing it I was taken from a Stannis
laughs LEM story about carrot who is
torn between love and destiny as a as a
killer I suppose you actually had
voiceover in that one so you made it a
bit easier for the audience but why did
you choose this particular clip you know
it was a commission from the Polish
Cultural Institute they were doing a
traveling exhibition of Stanislav LEM in
England and then it never happened but
the film kept State Commission
and they said you must choose one of the
his famous robot stories there were 10 I
think and in the the the volume that we
had there were 2 extra stories which we
presume were part of the robot stories
but apparently they weren't so we chose
Moscow which is this one and but they
were fine Institute was fine with it so
that's we did that one but I think that
we it was again with this notion of
poetic science fiction that really
attracted us well it's again myth fairy
tale yeah yes exactly I do want it
before we go to the audience I do want
to talk to you about the door was breath
briefly because you do have an
opportunity to see it and I do urge you
to it was actually the best film I saw
all last year so I think it's tremendous
its best 22 minutes I spent watching a
film last year and it's based on a sum
right and by fellows bet or an
Argentinian writer that uruguay
uruguayan
sorry that I'd never heard of of course
I did read the story before seeing the
film which didn't help help me at all
when I watched the film I still had no
idea what was going on really but it but
it was absolutely wonderful and can you
just talk a little bit about how you
came to make that film and well the the
the longer story is that we were we had
traveled with and that we were trying to
get I'll start again in New York our
production come psych guys to
distributes our films wanted to do a
blu-ray and they didn't they ran out of
money I think and because Christopher
Nolan has his first film with zeitgeist
and he knows the people very well he
offered to make brand new 35 no prints
of all the 35 mil films that we've
and then it was made into a traveling
show of which Christopher became a part
of and we were in New York together and
on the strength of that we got up the
nerve to ask Christopher would he in in
name only help with the sanatorium
project which is now at the tent and he
deliberated for a while and then he said
since we begun the film digitally you
know my feelings about digital films he
said I'm gonna offer you you can make a
new project on condition that it's in 35
millimeter and longer than 30 minutes so
you go for so in a sense that that's
what this project came from was his
commission and just saying yeah a good
producer and he wasn't bothered about
what you've filmed as long as it was on
35 no we and we made a very detailed
scenario and he questioned it at one
point basically saying I didn't
understand the thing but he says but
then I understand that you're visually
so I trust you so and how was it working
on 34 I forgetting after some time after
15 almost 20 years now we had to 35
millimeter cameras in our studio and we
were using them as glorified back door
stops so we just resurrected one of them
and you know funny how the fingers
remember how to thread a camera so it
was the odd thing was ultimately in the
end there we were loading the film every
day and unloading the film but all the
files came back as digital files so you
didn't touch the film after that that
felt strange very strange
okay that we do have microphones so
please put up your hand and somebody
will bring your mic yes is somebody here
hello
it's Creek Oh from Japan movie we have
movie website koat.com
actually I have two quick questions
first is about your creation or boo
masks and puppets your puppets has often
no eyes and I'm wondering if you have
any inspiration from the Japanese masks
because we have the even the traditional
theatre form calls no using masks so do
you have any and did you get any
inspiration from that and the second
question is that in Japan we often says
the puppets have spirit so if you treat
them badly they will avenge you do you
believe in such a kind of mysticism
thank you now of course we know about
the the no theater and the Bunraku
theatre and that's I don't think we were
thinking about that but I mean and there
was only that's there's only one film
where we the puppets don't have eyes and
that's in crocodiles so and that was
meant to be more symbolic that they were
they were more like robots
rather than humans or well human-like
what was the other question
Oh spirit yes well that's why the new
film is called the dolls breath we do
believe in the breath of the doll yes
yes and pretty elves got a question I'm
sure somebody must even you know what
does this film in yes over here
hello and I have a question about the
Edit King editing and it seems to be
that you it's very important for you
also next to the building the puppets
also the editing how much time do you
need for the editing and how important
is it for you to create the story the
montage is done simultaneously we shoot
we make the montage on the same day so
if it doesn't work with the music
then you reshoot or you rethink but it's
always done in correlation with the
music because the music is is always the
the bed so to speak what you have to I
mean we were shooting thirty five we had
a steamed back so we added it on the
steamed back now you edit on
you know After Effects or Final Cut Pro
with with the music I mean you decide
very early on which music you're going
to be using and then do you just sort of
have it playing while you're filming and
then edit to to the music as well I
think once you've made a major choice
it's you play it again and again and
again you take it into your system
completely like in the the new one the
dolls breath it's 20 minutes of music
the same with Stockhausen it was you
know 20 minutes of pure pure music so
it's it's both a challenge but it's also
finding that that contamination of
between image and music and where it's
working and and where it's where it's
it's challenging you to find the
language that that will approximate that
music and
in a way you can you might have
something written in the scenario but
you know it's it's wrong it's not gonna
work here so you're constantly working
day by day it's very organic the process
and you know you talk a lot we sit and
talk every night about where we're it's
where we think it's at at that point the
film and when you've done music promos
that's obviously slightly different
because they're commissioning you
they're saying this is our choice of
music come in how does that work for you
what's the way it's like you're working
with your left hand you know you know
it's well you can be serious about
working with your left hands yes I mean
pop videos it's a divergence it's like
doing on that first clip it's like doing
all the commercials we realized that you
know if we were going to survive being
filmmakers that to do one commercial a
year which just takes six weeks you know
we'd have another forty six weeks
totally free to do what we wanted so in
the end that was the payoff you got a
lot of money for doing something stupid
but you could also do it elegantly
without compromising yourself some very
great filmmakers have made commercials
like Eve Ingmar Bergman made commercials
right the toothpaste that's how good I
found the under Kareena through a soap
commercial yes remember that a good
while ago your names
suddenly popped up in the music business
in that you were defended by Kurt Cobain
of all people because he felt that some
of the early tool videos were ripoffs of
what you did so I was wondering did you
speak to Adam Jones a guitar player of
tool who made those videos at all and do
you even care that people rip your work
off no we didn't we didn't know about
that I mean we did somebody
did tell us finally but you know I think
we're great
yeah it is a sincere form of flattery
yeah no I don't I think sometimes what
you object to is say on on YouTube when
they take your film and they put another
music on and then they try to sell their
their CD or off your back if we find
that a bit insulting and that seems to
be pretty common people doing that so
that sort of gets in your gets up your
nose
yes you're worth a lot with books
adapting books so speaking about Valtor
and the Institute panda mint and all the
other films you've done that come from
books could you speak a little bit more
about that process making a book a film
and how do you live through it how do
you choose what you stuff I think that
ultimately you're looking if you if you
read say something a vulture or say Phil
Spector Hernandez or say Stanislaw
phlegm you immediately say there's the
text but you have to create the image
istic realm which is the parallel realm
that that you want to be really
independent of the text in masks we used
a bit of the text because it was so
beautiful
but and the same with foster but
sometimes with the Phyllis Berto
there's been no text at all it's just a
parallel visual realm but no I mean we
we read and you know you there's some
things that you say are very imagistic
and you want to you think that you can
thread images throughout other times you
say that's pure literature and it stays
this literature you don't touch it
somebody else had to hand up the staff
hey also about Roy Bulger in the novel
the characters they are like teenagers
right but in your adaptation of Jacob
bond Gunton I noticed that you
deliberately made the characters look
older you know a way why is that why not
I mean I think you needs to be a little
depth in the character and there they
have to be a little scarred in life to
come to the Institute because if you
want to become a zero in life you're not
a young person who would believe in that
we speak from experience anybody else
got a question there's still got a few
minutes left
well I've just got a couple somebody put
the handle okay wait for the microphone
Jeff asked a question about objects and
images coming round and round in your
films and of course you know unlike most
filmmakers you actually have a stock of
things of objects which you know
presumably you keep in drawers like in
the cabinet of dr. Frank might but I
wonder how much these objects that you
keep actually dictate their own terms to
you you know if you've used a mirror or
a rusty screw or a lens or something or
a doll or
heart of a doll do these things require
to be used again do you find there's an
object which is insisting that you find
a way to use it either for the first
time or or multiple times I think every
object has its also has its memory and
either you bring that to the fore or you
say you exclude that memory and you give
it a new memory or a new potential for
that for another memory I think it's
like you you're also like we tend to
scour the the flea markets and you know
sometimes you're going looking for
something in particular
most of the time what that never works
because you never find it what happens
usually is that you you wander upon
something you didn't expect and you see
sometimes the way the person who has his
store in the market he's arranged
certain things whose objects his wares
in a certain pattern that or you don't
know but if he's doing it artistically
or unselfconscious you know
unconsciously or what but we'll wander
onto this this little display and we
both instinctively will look at each
other and and we know exactly the object
something's kicking something's
reverberating and we'll usually buy that
thing plus the thing next to it side of
it to make it cheaper but in a sense
what you're seeing what we'd like is
that that randomness or that that sense
of the chance encounter where you find
that one little element of I mean you
could say it's a surrealist poetry you
could call it what you want but it's
that something you hear that sort of
knocking deep inside the the object that
you think this has potential and I we
tend to take it back to the studio and
we sort of put it somewhere we sort of
have an area where we put objects but a
lot of times we don't use it for that
for that filmer and we might it might
not come up until two or three films
later and it seems right so there's no
logic sometimes you know clearly we will
maybe have reused something but I like
to think we always do it under a
different atmosphere or or barometric
pressure is different for that that
scene couple of things I want to ask
before we tie up one is I mean you've
spoken about the drawers and I'm not
thinking of objects in them but ideas
and moods and projects maybe is there
one drawer one project still that you
haven't taken up that ladder yet and
you'd really like to do I mean obviously
there's a glass sanatorium but something
else is there anything else that you
know you have a burning ambition that
you would love to do no because I think
that that the the sanatorium projects
been something that's been going wrong
since really Street of crocodiles so
it's been a long long project and it's
that you know it's gone through many
manifestations the script but you feel
like it has to be now you know this is
the one and we started you know a couple
before the Christopher Nolan project we
started filming it we filmed about 25
minutes of the material already so it's
a project it just sort of deep your
deeply locked into and say that one has
to be acquitted before we can even think
of I mean of course a project might come
out of the blue and if we like it we
probably you know might do it but it
just depends and finally I mean you sort
of said you you go and see these objects
and you immediately get kicks for both
of you you've been working now together
for half a century you
disagree and if so when that happens how
do you resolve it if we disagree between
saying using a 50 mil lens or a 105
that's not an issue we can shoot it in
both ways and then we decide afterwards
in the end also you you it's like you
put the bottle of wine on the table
two glasses and you work it out you know
you talk it out and and you realize
you're making one film not two films and
that's it's for the good of the film not
the good of our ego or one of our egos
like that it's you get over it like it
was sadly it's exactly four o'clock so
we do have to attack but before you
would thank him at the end Stephen
please I do urge you to go and see the
dolls breath and indeed the exhibition
because fabulous stuff thank you very
much and thank you statement
[Applause]

good afternoon welcome everybody I'm

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perpetrate::verb | Spocien Dictionary

perpetrate

verb

/'pɜrpɪ,treɪt/

perform an act, usually with a negative connotation

Type	Words
Synonyms	commit, pull
Type of	act, move
Has types	make, recommit
Derivation	perpetration, perpetrator

perpetrate a crime.

How to pronounce perpetrate in Dutch?

perpetrate::verb | Spocien Dictionary

abandonment

Related words

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